Re: [ut3servers] don't call us, we'll call you

As fascinating as this discussion is, the server list is not the place for
it.

- Steve

-----Original Message-----
From: UT3 Servers [mailto:UT3SERVERS (AT) LIST (DOT) EPICGAMES.COM] On Behalf Of
Sir_Brizz - BeyondUnreal
Sent: Friday, November 28, 2008 4:04 PM
To: UT3SERVERS (AT) LIST (DOT) EPICGAMES.COM
Subject: Re: [ut3servers] don't call us, we'll call you

You're missing many important points in your post which just
accentuate the problem of getting these people to test the game.

First, you're proposing having a closed playtest but ignoring that it
increases the probability for leaking with little to no return.

Second, how are these people supposed to test the gameplay when the
gameplay isn't finalized, the dedicated server is not complete, they
have nowhere to play, to say nothing about distribution problems and
such.

So what you're basically saying is that the publisher of a game should
foot the expense of delaying the release of their games by
weeks/months in order to find problems that only a few people who play
the game for several hours a day are going to find.

As I indicated in my last email, most of theproblems that are in the
game aren't going to be found by any amount of limited playtesting,
and providing a working nearly full version of the game to a big
enough audience to do what youare suggesting would cost too much time
and money. I don't think it is reasonable to desire it at all.

Brizz

On 11/28/08, Noel Houck <nhouck (AT) gmail (DOT) com> wrote:
> On Thu, Nov 27, 2008 at 2:53 PM, Sir_Brizz - BeyondUnreal <
> sir_brizz (AT) beyondunreal (DOT) com> wrote:
>
>> I don't agree.
Read more on: : i3D.net Game Forums /unreal-tournament-3-newsletter/40584-re-ut3servers-dont-call-us-well-call-you.html
>>
>> The reason big shot gamers find thenuances in the game is because of
>> the inordinate amount of time they spend playing them.
>
>
> No not really. These nuances usually show up within the first 2-4 weeks
of
> playing the game. From there they may be practiced and developed, but
most
> top players get a very good feel for the game within a couple weeks of
Read more on: : i3D.net Game Forums http://forum.i3d.net/showthread.php?t=40584
daily
> play.
>
>
>>
>>
>> Now, take away any semblance of a reasonale player base for them to
>> practice with, and chances are that they will find themselves
>> verylimited in what they ca actually find.
>
>
> Top players usually play other top players because they get bored
playing
> average pubs. Trust me, they wouldn't have any trouble finding games
with
> each other as they have for years. They pretty much are all good
friends.
>
>
>>
>>
>> Lots of thesebig shots played the game at conferences and stuff during
>> most of 2007, but they weren't saying anything about the movement
>> feeling weird then (but, personally, i can't quantify what that even
>> means because the movement itself feels perfectly fine to me). We can
>> only assume that this is because it wasn't until after they could play
>> the game any time they wanted to with a large amount of people,
>> possibly on the same skill level as them, that they could tell
>> something was off.
>
>
> I never said they would be able to provide instant feedback. Frankly
any
> feedback from 20 minutes of playing a game is not worth having. 2-4
weeks
> is an appropriate amount of time playing the game against other top
players
> to get worthwhile feedback. Thus why the devs should get the game in
their
> hands much earlier in the development cycle.
>
>
>>
>>
>> This is something no amount of limited playtesting can identify,
>> really. And what developr is ging to pay someone egregious amounts of
>> money to do nothing but play their game all day? Nobody can fford
>> that. It will ALWAYS be the end users that find these kinds of issues
>> with your game (or any other program) hands down.
>
>
> You think players would want egregious amounts of money to play test the
new
> hot game before it hits the shelves? I don't think so. I'm sure you
would
> find most would do it for free, and be happy to provide feedback for
free
> for the opportunity to play the game and help the devs improve it before
it
> hits the shelves. One of the things the competitive community has
always
> asked for is to have the dev team listen to them more about design
issues,
> but they feel that they have been snubbed repeatedly and by now they
have
> pretty much given up on the idea that the devs care at all about their
> needs.
>
> Of course even if they did pay the players a small amount of cash like a
few
> hundred bucks each for say 20 top players that would be a drop in the
bucket
> for Epic or any other game publisher for the quality feedback they would
get
> in return. I'm sure they pay way more than that to the QA team who only
> really provides bug reports and normal gameplay feedback, but no real
game
> polish type of feedback.
>
> ---------------------
> TO LEAVE THE LIST
> ---------------------
> Write to LISTSERV (AT) LIST (DOT) EPICGAMES.COM and, in the text of your
message
> (not the subject line), write: SIGNOFF UT3SERVERS
>


--
Sir_Brizz
BeyondUnreal Administrator
sir_brizz (AT) beyondunreal (DOT) com
Visit us at http://www.beyondunreal.com !

---------------------
TO LEAVE THE LIST
---------------------
Write to LISTSERV (AT) LIST (DOT) EPICGAMES.COM and, in the text of your message
(not the subject line), write: SIGNOFF UT3SERVERS

---------------------
TO LEAVE THE LIST
---------------------
Write to LISTSERV (AT) LIST (DOT) EPICGAMES.COM and, in the text of your message
(not the subject line), write: SIGNOFF UT3SERVERS